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Kelly announces QB derby a four-man race heading into spring

Mar 20, 2012, 8:17 PM EDT

Tommy Rees BC

In his first official press conference marking the start of spring practice, it didn’t take long for Brian Kelly to field a question about his unsettled quarterback depth chart. In fact, it was the first one asked. With the Irish plagued by inconsistency at the position last season, and going through three different options last year, Kelly announced it was open season at the position most responsible for offensive competency next season.

“I think it’s important that if they’re all going to get an equal opportunity to compete for the position,” Kelly said.

With that, the four-man race between juniors Tommy Rees and Andrew Hendrix, sophomore Everett Golson, and early-enrollee Gunner Kiel begins. And while hyperbole tends to become the norm during spring practice, it’s not too much of an overstatement to think that this positional race could not only define next season, but also the head coaching era.

With first-year offensive coordinator Chuck Martin coaching the quarterbacks and running the day-to-day operations of the offense, implementing a fair competition meant dialing back an offensive system that might have been too advanced for even Rees, the elder statesman of the group, to completely grasp (or at the very least execute without making major mistakes). With Martin getting his first official minutes working with the position, starting an evaluation process at a similar knowledge base is a smart decision.

“We’ve kind of taken a step back and really looked at our offensive structure, and we’re going to make it so all four of the guys that are here can compete at a fair level, because Tommy has got, as you know, the best knowledge base,” Kelly said. “But if we started the spring with page 50 of the playbook, Tommy would be ahead of everybody. So not to put him at a disadvantage but to give it an equal footing for all, we’ve kind of scaled it back, so the spring, it’s going to give all the quarterbacks, including a midyear in Gunner and of course the two young guys, an opportunity to truly compete for the position.”

While it’s too early to jump to any true conclusions, this is certainly the type of rhetoric you’d want to hear if you were hoping for a fresh start at the position. With a new coordinator communicating Kelly’s vision of the offense, dialing things back to the basics should let Martin and Kelly measure apples to apples, as opposed to having to grade each quarterback on how well they do the things they already understand, a slippery slope that makes evaluation — and objectivity — a difficult task.

As you’d expect, Kelly wasn’t quick to offer a decision date, likely realizing any time before the Irish head to Dublin will be good enough. For the first time since Kelly’s opening date against Purdue in 2010, the offense has a bit of mystery to it, with Martin, an unknown at quarterback, and some interesting skill position moves (more on that later) working in the Irish’s favor.

For now, spring is simply about improving a unit that made far too many mistakes and needs to find a capable triggerman for the Irish offense. While we’ll have 15 practices to parse comments and dissect the limited window we’ll get into the Irish offense, the very important step of clearing the records and starting anew is a promising first step.


  1. ccad05 - Mar 20, 2012 at 8:36 PM

    Tommie will transfer at some point this season.

    • turknd - Mar 20, 2012 at 9:51 PM

      Not sure he’ll leave but I think his role w/ ND as a starting QB is over. It will be a hard decision between Hendrix and Golsen – still think it will be a split. I think Hendrix has the tools to build on for the position. Golsen too, but, for me, I need to see his passing skills on the college level in a game.

    • bernhtp - Mar 20, 2012 at 11:11 PM

      Do you really think Tommy would leave over not being named the started, not get his ND degree, lose a year of play, and transfer elsewhere?

      While I don’t think Tommy has the ability to lead this program to the next level, he is a competitor and has already spent way more time under center than he ever could have expected. He isn’t going anywhere. He will compete, hope to win the job, and if he loses, wait for another opportunity to play again.

      • 9irish - Mar 21, 2012 at 4:07 AM

        I agree with that….he has been a tough customer, got in there thru effort, guts. I think they should have others now that are technically better, but I don’t think he’ll go anywhere. I don’t think he had hopes pinned to the NFL or anything.

    • dmac4real - Mar 21, 2012 at 12:58 AM

      Hed have 1 year of eligibility left. Not to mention 1 year away from graduating from a prestigious university.

  2. ccad05 - Mar 20, 2012 at 9:47 PM


  3. smurphdoggy29 - Mar 20, 2012 at 9:54 PM

    Production, simple as that. Which of the 4 can produce, not manage, but produce within the offense. It is that simple.

    I think volumes were spoken without uttering the words when Coach Kelly said they would all be given an equal opportunity. The entire thread reverberates with an echo of dissatisfaction with the guy who has the most knowledge of the offense. The guy in charge and the new guy orchestrating the offense want one of the other 3 to show a grasp of what is happening. Then I believe they’ll build from there.

    Perhaps Tommy doesn’t have as fair a shot as it would seem. Could be he will transfer as mentioned above, yet all anybody really wants is consistent production.

    Let’s hope for the best !

    GO Irish !

    • jimbasil - Mar 21, 2012 at 11:24 AM

      Tommy has had a, more than fair shot at retaining the starters position. If you are discussing fair, then Crist was not given his fair shot.

      Tommy’s proven his value and he is a good QB, but maybe not the QB ND needs with this collection of talent. Far too many turnovers and mistakes due to lack of physical talent by TR.

      I think, and most would agree, Tommy is a good guy, a positive guy, a team guy and will only get stronger physically but the rigors of College level play are just beyond his physical ability.

      It could turn out TR was snake bit last year and is indeed the better QB at this time at ND, but his past performances say something different.

      Other than Crist being stowed too quickly, AH didn’t get a fair shot at all. Thrust into games in difficult situations asked to perform at a better level than Rees without a decent amount of prep. To me, that’s the unfair deal.

      As much as I like Kelly, and I like Kelly as ND coach, he made an enormous mistake not working with AH while pouring all his attention on trying to make TR something he likely isn’t –

      • nudeman - Mar 21, 2012 at 11:49 AM

        I agree with 99% of what you write. The 1% is this:
        I think you, like many here, overrate AH. Don’t get me wrong, I like him, think his athletic talent is enormous, and he clearly is a better option than TR.

        But I saw stuff last year that makes me think he’s not the guy. I’m speaking of the throwing motion and the fact that he seemed to get rattled easily.

        Would it be a terrible thing if he was named the starter? Not at all. IMO, is he “the answer”? No.

        • jimbasil - Mar 21, 2012 at 12:42 PM

          Yeah, I’ve heard it all the negatives about his motion and just don’t see it. I’ve heard he has too long of an arm motion – not quick enough, the angle of his motions is wrong, when clearly there doesn’t appear to be anything really amiss, – he has no touch, well, that would belie his tapes from HS (not a comparison of playing level) where he threw accurately, leading receivers and he threw with touch, fade routes etc. If there is anything I’d say he needs work on (from the couch position not a coach position) at this level, he needs to have the game slow down in his head, he needs to know his offense (not play book, though he does need that) rather his mates on the field and their abilities/tendencies.

          But this wasn’t a post about AH being named Starter QB at ND, it was about being fair to all QB’s and giving them an equal shot at the position of leading the team offense.

      • nudeman - Mar 21, 2012 at 2:30 PM

        “Fair” is a subjective thing. That would seem to be a contradiction, but here’s my point: BK has now spent 2 years (almost) with AH, 2 years with Rees, and 1 year with EG. He absolutely KNOWS, barring a big surprise who his starter will be.

        Everyone will get reps with the 1st team and the chance to excel. But by now, BK has a pretty good idea of who can do what and who he thinks is his guy. All the stuff about “everybody starts from square 1” is to show them all a modicum of respect and get them to play hard.

        It will be AH or EG.

      • turknd - Mar 21, 2012 at 8:01 PM

        Jimbasil, I agree re: throwing motion. I just watched some highlights and I don’t see a long throwing motion. As a matter of fact it looks like a quick release to me. It may not be completely over the top, but neither was Jeff George (John Gruden said in his book that he had one of the strongest arm he’s ever seen- head case though).

  4. ndfanwabashman - Mar 20, 2012 at 10:21 PM

    I don’t think we’ll really know who the starter is until game three of the regular season

  5. ttirish - Mar 20, 2012 at 10:31 PM

    Tommy Rees is a good QB. Whether or not he starts in 2012 is an open question. Kelley wants speed, speed, speed. You only have to look at Tony Pike of his Cincinatti teams of a few years ago to see how fast the QB got rid of the ball and/or made decisions. That is the type of offense BK is developing and that is the type of QB who ill lead the Irish.

  6. bernhtp - Mar 20, 2012 at 10:33 PM

    Does anyone else find Kelly’s description of the QB competition a bit odd? He went through great pains to outline an objective process where no one had a head start or unfair advantage. All the while, Kelly is the head coach and will ultimately use his personal/subjective assessment of performance. It seems like he is bending over backwards to not repeat his seemingly-capricious QB decisions last year that left everyone mystified. He wants buy-in of the result from the QB losers, the rest of the team, the university, and the fan base.

    • turknd - Mar 20, 2012 at 10:50 PM

      Not really. Last year Christ came out flat in the first gameand tanked and also w/ other opportuniies in later games. while Tommy energized the offense coming in, he is still one dimensional and defense’s caught on to that. Having said that, I think he has respect for Tommy not to throw him under the bus and perhaps he will need him a some point. The competion is beteween Hendrix and Golsen.

      • nudeman - Mar 20, 2012 at 11:19 PM

        First, it’s “Crist”, not “Christ”

        Second, nothing odd about it. What is he supposed to say? “Tommy is toast and it’s between AH, EG and GK”?
        He wants everyone playing their hardest, competing for the job.

        And to whoever said “Tommy will transfer”, I doubt it. He’s led a charmed life the last two years, starting when most didn’t think he should have, and frankly playing poorly too often, particularly against good teams. If he wants to seek out a lesser program so he can play, more power to him. That’s his right. But I say he goes nowhere.

        Having said that, if you look at what BK said about “escapability”, he wasn’t describing Tommy. So … not too hard to figure out that TR is #4 or at best #3 on the unofficial depth chart.

      • borromini - Mar 21, 2012 at 12:18 AM

        Third, it’s Golson, not Golsen…

      • bernhtp - Mar 21, 2012 at 8:59 AM

        Nude: of course Kelly would never say that Tommy is toast, but my point is the lengthy and elaborate description of the competition process went far beyond this purpose. While some of the simplification of the offense is for his own evaluation, I have the feeling that it also is for appearances; he doesn’t want to construct a situation where Tommy obviously excels over the others (running the full offense where he has most experience) and then chooses another as the starter.

      • nudeman - Mar 21, 2012 at 10:50 AM

        Yes, agree. I was sort of trying to say the same thing.
        Two things stuck out in BK’s presser to me:
        1) talked of “escapability” and its importance to the offense;
        2) said they threw far too many INTs last year.

        #1 is clearly NOT good for TR.
        #2 is neutral. I expect TR would improve somewhat here and the other guys being so inexperienced will throw a couple INTs that will make us want to tear our hair out.

        But all that said, let’s be honest. TR is not going to be the starter.
        I think even BK knows that.

  7. 1historian - Mar 21, 2012 at 6:37 AM

    Hendrix and Rees were part of BK’s 1st recruiting class but they weren’t HIS recruits. TR got the start last year (after Crist) because he had more experience than Hendrix, being an EE. TR was never that good but he did his best with the ability he had and it is not fair to dump on him – he’s a good kid who gave it everything he had. I realize people WILL dump on him, rather continue to dump on him, but it’s just not fair.

    Golson is BK’s 1st recruit at the position. Redshirt last year start this year. In the long run it will be between Golson and Kiel.

    • nudeman - Mar 21, 2012 at 10:54 AM

      Well said sir.
      To tony343434 – the only way Rees starts is injuries to the other guys.
      Otherwise, zero chance

      • dickasman - Mar 21, 2012 at 11:08 AM


        way to butter up to a coach. Now I see how you get your inside info.

      • bernhtp - Mar 21, 2012 at 12:53 PM

        The problem with Tommy as #2 is his inability to run the same offense that Hendrix and Golson (and Kiel) can run. Hendrix and Golson can run read option, lateral option, buy time on the roll, pass deep or hard sideline, throw the fade, and other capabilities apparently beyond the abilities of Rees. This means a different play set for Rees vs. the other QBs, which is obviously problematic.

    • jimbasil - Mar 21, 2012 at 11:48 AM

      I was sure Kelly went after Hendrix when Hendrix opened up his recruiting to other schools. Hendrix looked to be going to UF and likely not coming to ND – but Kelly converted him back to ND.

      Hendrix is Kelly’s guy.

  8. tony34343434 - Mar 21, 2012 at 10:44 AM

    the most important position of the field is of course QB, like many of you i do not trust Rees but any of the other 3 quarterbacks will stuggle first full year so 2012 would be some what of a rebuilding year. If you are going to do that might as well start Kiel and getting the growing pains out of the way. I still think Rees is starting, not sure if BK will throw this year away on an unproven guy. Go Irish.

    • dickasman - Mar 21, 2012 at 11:05 AM

      Mr. Tony Alford everyone. When Irish coach is saying this, I tend to believe him. Thanks coach Alford for chiming in.

    • 1historian - Mar 22, 2012 at 10:43 PM

      I just don’t buy the notion that the offense is so complex that it will take someone a full season to get it.

      Rees has done his best, his best is not good enough.
      Hendrix is ok, but he’s nothing special. I’m told that the guy is in pre-med so he has got to be pretty smart.
      Golson is BK’s first recruit at the position and he has had a year to run the practice squad (win an award for it), gain weight and watch from the sideline.

      Whoever gets the nod will have lots of offensive firepower to help him until he gets his feet wet and lots of large, unfriendly, talented linemen to watch over him whilst he struggles – Put Golson out there and say ‘sink or swim!!’

      Sooner or later you HAVE to put Golson out there, IMO. Why not now?

  9. dickasman - Mar 21, 2012 at 11:02 AM

    Hey guys here’s spring practice update from chicago tribune.

    Davonte needs to be on defense you say? Have a look at the first unit WR’s. Its freaking ROSARY time already guys, OMG! Are you kidding me? Seriously….That’s gotta be the most pathetic trio of starting WR’s in a long time. My high school team had better trio of receivers than these 3. Thanks alot dingleberry! Hope Daniel Smith and/or chris brown steps up QUICK!!!

    Add Tommy Rees as a starter and we’ve got nanannana nanananaana heyheyhey goooooood byyyyyye! ALOT left to be desired and ALOT of unknowns with regards to arguably the 2 most important positions on a football team.

    I didn’t like Nicklas moving to TE at first but now I think that may actually pan out(Gronk). As long as he promises to stay away from the ecstasy and jumping. I’d say dancing but I wouldn’t call what he did dancing.

    Love that BJ(no pull your pants back up, not that one) but Bennett Jackson starting out at CB. I like what very little of him that I saw. I also love this kids “tude”. He’s got that cocky FU mother attitude on top of I am going to pop you if you catch the ball mentality that every corner needs to have. This is my dark horse player of the year. Hope he can cover.

    After reading all this, I’ll still be diehard domer but actually thinking of converting to buddhism so I have an excuse to take a trip to Thailand and pray w the buddhas.

    SOUTH BEND, Ind. — Very little of substance can be gleaned from a no-pads, just-after-daybreak March workout for a college football team.

    But Notre Dame invited everyone in for a quick peek on its first day of spring practice Wednesday, and the assembled caffeinated media dutifully trudged in for a look, so might as well divulge what everyone saw:

    The candidates in the Irish quarterback battle won’t speak to the media until the end of the week. But in the opening “tempo” drills against a non-existent defense, incumbent starter Tommy Rees took the first snaps with the first-team offense.

    And then shortly thereafter, junior Andrew Hendrix jumped in for a handful of reps — much like Dayne Crist and Rees shuttled in and out with the first unit during their competition last fall. Everett Golson exclusively took the second-team reps, and freshman Gunner Kiel was a bystander.

    Irish coach Brian Kelly, meanwhile, unsurprisingly devoted all his attention during the 30-minute viewing window to the quarterbacks. The signal-callers got a heavy dose of footwork drills and throwing on the move when the team broke down to positon-by-position work.

    If the competition to fill out the right side of the offensive line is as interesting as Kelly expects it to be, Christian Lombard and Tate Nichols began spring practice with a nominal head start.

    Lombard, a junior, took the first-team reps at right guard and the 6-foot-8-inch, 320-pound Nichols took the snaps at right tackle.

    Though Kelly said he expects a leap in production from wideout DaVaris Daniels, the sophomore from Vernon Hills took reps with the second-team offense during the opening tempo drills. The first-unit receivers comprised Robby Toma, TJ Jones and fifth-year returnee John Goodman.

    Troy Niklas wore No. 85 on his first official day as a tight end, with the sophomore moving over from linebacker, and at 6-feet-7-inches and 252 pounds immediately dwarfed basically every other returnee at the position.

    USC transfer running back Amir Carlisle wore a No. 3 jersey…and an immobilizing boot on his left foot. Carlisle hobbled through practice on crutches after breaking his ankle earlier this month, with his return slated for summer workouts.

    It was a future-is-now arrangement on the defensive line. Not shockingly, sophomores Aaron Lynch and Stephon Tuitt bookended nose guard Louis Nix on the first-unit front to open practice.

    Veteran Kapron Lewis-Moore, a fifth-year returnee, worked with the second team.

    No surprises, either, with the refurbished Irish secondary. Lo Wood and Bennett Jackson lined up as the first-unit cornerbacks, not that there are many other options available anyway. Zeke Motta and Jamoris Slaughter slotted in as the safeties.

    Nose guard Tony Springmann was held out of the workout after an offseason back procedure will have him limited in the spring.

    • bernhtp - Mar 21, 2012 at 1:21 PM

      Dick, don’t read too much in who takes the field first. It will be those with the most tenure.

      Look out for the killer Ds – Davaris Daniels, Daniel Smith and Davonte Neal – to make an impact this year at WR.

      I also expect Eifert to occasionally line up wide with a TE (Koyak or Nicklas). Imagine a power set having Eifert and Koyak on one side to block for a back, throw to, or use as a decoy for the read option opposite side or deep sideline to the WR. I expect some offensive innovation this year along with more capability at the QB.

  10. ndfan4ever - Mar 21, 2012 at 11:51 AM

    Here is an article from

    1. Notre Dame
    The Irish have to fine one guy and stick with him. So, Brian Kelly’s starting quarterback will be … ? It’ll be up in the air throughout the offseason. Tommy Rees has the experience and he’s at the time in his career when he should take the next step forward, but too many puzzling interceptions and too many turnovers at the worst possible times have kept the door open. He might be great in practices, but that’s not the problem; how will he hold up game-in and game out in key situations?

    Andrew Hendrix provided a spark at times when he got his chance, but the dual-threat playmaker hasn’t had any pressure as a relief pitcher and has yet to show he can be the main man when the spotlight is on. Everett Golson has a huge arm and might have the best all-around tools of any of the options, and super-recruit Gunner Kiel is the Chosen One as the next great Irish quarterback, but will Kelly live through another year of growing pains? Golson or Kiel would be a step back this year to potentially take a huge leap forward, but with one of college football’s nastiest schedules, experience will be at a premium. However, it’ll all come down to consistency. If Rees can eliminate the mistakes and if he can show a better command of the offense, the job might be his for the taking even if he might not have the upside of Golson or Kiel.

    All the people that want TR not to be the starting QB please remember that there is no one behind him with any real experience at all. If like the article says he can limit the miscue’s he is the best bet right now anyway so stop calling for his head. With the Irish’s up coming schedule starting a rookie QB does not look good for us. A hugh step backward might not even come close to what might happen. A 5-8 season would be a disaster and that is what you are looking at with a rookie QB. Good luck to all and GO IRISH

    • nudeman - Mar 21, 2012 at 12:32 PM

      I simply disagree with the writer’s assessment.
      Based on everything we know and have heard from BK, there is not a single fiber in my Irish body that thinks BK believes “the job might be Rees’ for the taking”.

      A certain amount of BK’s job includes NOT making ridiculous choices that will cost you so much political capital with fans, students and alums. Last year he made that mistake with Dayne vs. TR; I don’t see him going down that road again.

      • bernhtp - Mar 21, 2012 at 1:05 PM

        Exactly. My point previously is that there is a lot of showmanship around the QB competition to keep everyone bought in and working hard, but I would be shocked if Kelly’s decision was not already mostly made, and that decision does not include TR anywhere near the top. Been there, done that.

      • dickasman - Mar 21, 2012 at 1:07 PM

        Yeah, I do not think that BK is sold on TR. He had to go with him last year. This is his final year(maybe depending on how badly irish perform). I don’t know what it is but my gut feeling is that I almost think that he will roll the dice with Golson.

  11. dickasman - Mar 21, 2012 at 1:08 PM

    I am just happy that we have an upgrade over Matt Mulvey in Tommy Rees.

    • bernhtp - Mar 21, 2012 at 1:22 PM

      Mulvey looked good in the red hat. TR will need to prove himself.

  12. jerseyshorendfan1 - Mar 21, 2012 at 2:26 PM

    Wow a four horse race. That’s almost enough entrants for a Kentucky Derby, let alone a QB Derby. I have to think it comes down to Golson or Hendrix when its all over. If Kelly values escapability, he’s not getting that from TR but AH and EG have both shown that ability. I don’t think you send the rookie in there at this point, better to let him take a year and learn the playbook, speed of the game, etc. I’m backing Golson at 3-1 odds.

  13. runners00 - Mar 21, 2012 at 4:19 PM

    I think it has to be Golson or Hendrix, unless Gunnar is really impressive.

    Golson seems to have some real speed. He looks like he’d be great to watch. And Hendrix may have a great arm but he gets rattled. We’ll see.

    But don’t tell me that Tommy’s in the running. We know what he can do. He’s a nice kid and a decent athlete. Really. But the types of teams that will show up next year are beyond what TR can do. And I say this as someone who supported him for awhile. Oklahoma, Southern Cal, Stanford and Michigan are all loaded — filled with guys who are headed for the pros. I don’t see Rees being able to manage an offense in that type of environment.

    It looks like both Golson and Hendrix are strong athletes who are capable of throwing the ball down the field. We’ll see. Should be fun.

  14. degosavage23 - Mar 22, 2012 at 4:31 AM

    It’s gonna be Hendrix or golson unless as stated earlier Kiel just blows everyone away with his play. In my opinion Hendrix seems to have all the tools: he can run, strong arm, decently accurate, but seems to make some really bone-headed moves (like throwing the ball directly into a defenders hands). Golson has been hyped as the prototypical spread quarterback with his blazing speed, elusiveness, and absolute cannon of an arm. From his high school film that certainly seems to be the case, but how will that translate onto the college field as he has even less experience than Hendrix=none whatsoever. Still should be interesting to see what happens. I give the edge to golson simply because he had a year to learn the playbook (rather than being thrown to the wolves as a true freshman), and his unique skill set. Not to mention a new look might be exactly what this offense needs.

  15. urfinished - Mar 22, 2012 at 1:42 PM

    Wish the kids all the luck in the world, but if it is Rees or Hendrix, we aren’t winning more than 7 games…maybe 8.

  16. helen618 - Mar 25, 2012 at 10:23 AM

    The smart money is on Golson. He is super elusive, has a great arm and is an awesome piano player. It is his job to lose. Hendrix will be #2 and can step in at any point – good runner and strong arm. Kiel should be redshirted. Rees will ride pine due to his lack of ‘escapability’. Thank you for your time.

  17. helen618 - Mar 25, 2012 at 10:32 AM

    A follow-up note on Everett Golson. If you’re going to comment on him, please learn to SPELL HIS NAME RIGHT!!!!

  18. helen618 - Mar 25, 2012 at 12:07 PM

    Everett Golson.

  19. boerussell - Mar 30, 2012 at 12:18 PM

    To think that someone other than Tommy Rees is going to win 8 or 9 games next year is a stretch to me. To pick anyone other than Rees to me would be to say that next year is going to be a rebuilding year. How many “rookie” QBs at this level are successful right away? My thought is that Rees is 5-7 HORRIBLE plays away from being a good starting QB. I would rather take a chance that Rees (with the help of simplified play calling inside the red zone) can eliminate the HORRIBLE plays than that a first year starter is going to be consistency solid in year #1.

  20. irish4006 - Apr 9, 2012 at 2:55 AM

    @boerussell – what about the year after that, or the one after? should we keep Rees for the next hundred years (not that NFL will come calling or anything) so that we don’t ever have a first year starter? In 2012, Hendrix will be a Junior, Golson a Sophomore and Kelly a 3rd year coach; not good enough for you? It may be news for some, but college players do not spend 15 years with one team, and some good ones actually leave after their junior season for NFL.

    Kelly felt Rees was the best option he had in the last couple of years (some armchair coaches felt Crist was better), and we lived through the pain. But, if he doesn’t have a quarterback ready to take over this team who is better than TR has been in the last couple of years, he is not a good coach. Either his offensive schemes are too complex to understand or he is incapable of shaping a QB to fit it. Based on his track record, neither should be the case.

    Re: “My thought is that Rees is 5-7 HORRIBLE plays away from being a good starting QB”, do you mind defining good? WRT TR, the expectation is so low, if he makes one good throw; some are so ecstatic that one would mistakenly think that we just won the national championship. Sheesh!

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